Confimred new owners of Raeding Footbal Club

[Uke]

Let's just hope next week sees this finally sorted out.

Why the timeline?

Don't care how long it takes as long as we get the right owners

Next season is all about survival, not promotion pushes nor relegation battles

No point having the 'right' owners if the club is destroyed because it has taken too long to find this mythical fairy godfather.

A fine balance between getting it sorted before we get on the slippery slope to points deduction and falling into the hands of the asset strippers...

Precisely; survival

[Dick Habbin's hairdo]

So the fate of RFC is in the hands of this bloke. http://www.begbies-traynorgroup.com/investor-relations/company-information/directors/mark-fry-head-of-insolvency-and-restructuring_11.aspx

Why not give him a bell or drop him an email, details on this link: http://www.begbies-traynorgroup.com/our-people/mark-fry_765-full.aspx

[Pseud O'Nym]

Let's just hope next week sees this finally sorted out.

Why the timeline?

Don't care how long it takes as long as we get the right owners

Next season is all about survival, not promotion pushes nor relegation battles

Does the 'right' owner exist though? Perfection would be another SJM, Dave Whelan, Bill Kenwright, Assem Allam type - someone who wants the club for its own sake - if there was one of those around for RFC I'm pretty sure they'd have surfaced long ago. Next comes billionaires looking for a plaything to massage their egos, we've just had probably the only one who'd be interested in RFC and that went well. All that's left is businessmen looking for an investment, a Venky's or a GFH Capital perhaps?

[3points]

Samuelson said the loan is due in August, which is when we get paid the parachute payment so that makes sense.

There must be some fear about being able to cover that payment though or else BGT wouldn't be involved. The lender being TSI or Boris doesn't fit with the other thing Samuelson said about them being known as lenders to premier league clubs, but then we can't trust everything he says can we?

The loan may be repayable in August but that doesn't mean that is when the parachute payment is made, though 30 June sounds plausible which is the end of the fiscal year for most football clubs

Could it be that TSI is Vibrac and Vibrac is TSI?

The loan agreement with Vibrac must have had step in rights attached to it, otherwise they would not be calling the shots today. They use these rights rather than place the club into administration, which is the route a "normal" lender would take. So at least they are being sensible and realising it is pretty catastrophic event for a club to go into administration.

Increasingly thinking this could look like a Pompey takeover, where "new owners' were found, but were, in reality, a front for the previous regime. Still, at least we can rely on the fit and proper persons test to protect us from unscrupulous new owners

[Pseud O'Nym]

Could it be that TSI is Vibrac and Vibrac is TSI?

Vibrac were active before TSI was incorporated, but it is an odd coincidence that their first reported activity seems to have been a loan to Everton, who had been briefly involved with Anton.

[GSY-Royal]

So the fate of RFC is in the hands of this bloke. http://www.begbies-traynorgroup.com/investor-relations/company-information/directors/mark-fry-head-of-insolvency-and-restructuring_11.aspx

Why not give him a bell or drop him an email, details on this link: http://www.begbies-traynorgroup.com/our-people/mark-fry_765-full.aspx

Just look at him. We're fcuked.

[Royal Rother]

Hmm, we do like a good conspiracy theory!

[genome]

[Uke]

Increasingly thinking this could look like a Pompey takeover, where "new owners' were found, but were, in reality, a front for the previous regime. Still, at least we can rely on the fit and proper persons test to protect us from unscrupulous new owners

Don't be ridiculous, there are no similarities. Sacha Gaydamak has a rich Russian father and was in his late twenties when he bought Portsmouth.

[3points]

just checked documents at Companies House regarding Vibrac loan. Premier League money is due in August, as per CS's statement.

And they do have step in rights if there's been a default on the loan - one default was unpaid tax bills. Those rights then allow them to take control of the assets, make disposals, etc (hence the sale of ALF no doubt)

[PieEater]

I thought the CS interview was pretty good, I don't really see him as the bad guy here.

Some interesting things he said:
- Confirmed a distressed sale is in progress
- Kebe and Mariappa sales (and presumably prem wages) didn't cover last seasons signings
- SJM/TSI wanted £25m for the club which was (in hindsight) too high
- AZ ran away because he couldn't get the money he was expecting to get - presumably from his dad!
- the wage bill needs a £10m to £12m topup each season
- the vibrac loan is £10.5m and due in Aug
- the debt is £20m, which sounds too low for me so I assume TSI/SJM are writing off around 50% of what they are owned
- He has directly approached 100 billionaires, and got offers that TSI/SJM rejected
- SJM has already got £17m back

He ends with hope that the current distressed sale isn't scuppers by the lender wanting more as he thinks the buyers will be a good fit. I guess our opinion of that will show how genuine he is if and when it happens, but to me he seemed like the sort of person the club needed to employ in order to secure a buyer and not as RL paints him.

[Pseud O'Nym]

[Royal Rother]

Just the hint of a cynical smirk / sneer.

Ideal for his job I guess.

[Ian Royal]

I thought the CS interview was pretty good, I don't really see him as the bad guy here.

Some interesting things he said:
- Confirmed a distressed sale is in progress
- Kebe and Mariappa sales (and presumably prem wages) didn't cover last seasons signings
- SJM/TSI wanted £25m for the club which was (in hindsight) too high
- AZ ran away because he couldn't get the money he was expecting to get - presumably from his dad!
- the wage bill needs a £10m to £12m topup each season
- the vibrac loan is £10.5m and due in Aug
- the debt is £20m, which sounds too low for me so I assume TSI/SJM are writing off around 50% of what they are owned
- He has directly approached 100 billionaires, and got offers that TSI/SJM rejected
- SJM has already got £17m back

He ends with hope that the current distressed sale isn't scuppers by the lender wanting more as he thinks the buyers will be a good fit. I guess our opinion of that will show how genuine he is if and when it happens, but to me he seemed like the sort of person the club needed to employ in order to secure a buyer and not as RL paints him.

Re Kebe & Mariappa I'm not really that surprised. We exchanged those two for Drenthe, Williams and Bridge - two of who may not have needed a transfer fee, but almost certainly would have had signing on fees.

Anton was expecting a mate to sign on and then to be able to rustle up other investors. Daddy was security from what I understand from reading all the recent interview stuff.

£46m last season in wages, and £10m - £12m blackhole suggests to me wages this season of somewhere in the region of £33m.

Without a huge chance of shifting probably our two biggest earners (Pog & Drenthe), we're gonna need to get rid of most of Guthrie, McCleary, Williams, Obita, McCarthy & Federici, if not more, to get even close to the level we need to reduce that. And I just can't see them all being desired enough.

[TheLawnMowerMan]

And they do have step in rights if there's been a default on the loan - one default was unpaid tax bills. Those rights then allow them to take control of the assets, make disposals, etc (hence the sale of ALF no doubt)

I guess it all depends on whether or not they have step in rights for any default, or just their loan. If they are not due to be paid until August then RFC will not have defaulted.
HMRC default may be included (very common for football clubs to do this and for this to be one of the first signs of trouble, with the next being unpaid wages), but as this has been remedied it is unclear if this would give them the right.
I do wonder if TSI is the lender in question who wants to get their money back and is frustrated with SJM wanting to find the "right" buyer. Could this be the reason CS and AO have left the board?
I guess they could also claim the club is technically insolvent which would enable a step in right from another lender to be exercised.

Regardless of all this, there is clearly still a lot of value left in the club and all creditors will be looking to get all, or the vast majority, of their cash back.
Assuming that all debts will be paid (which has already been indicated as such in the media) then the only interested party after that are the shareholders, who may wish to get money for the shares, a say in who buys them, and/or a life presidency.
Back to SJM.

[blueroyals]

I thought the CS interview was pretty good, I don't really see him as the bad guy here.

Some interesting things he said:
- Confirmed a distressed sale is in progress
- Kebe and Mariappa sales (and presumably prem wages) didn't cover last seasons signings
- SJM/TSI wanted £25m for the club which was (in hindsight) too high
- AZ ran away because he couldn't get the money he was expecting to get - presumably from his dad!
- the wage bill needs a £10m to £12m topup each season
- the vibrac loan is £10.5m and due in Aug
- the debt is £20m, which sounds too low for me so I assume TSI/SJM are writing off around 50% of what they are owned
- He has directly approached 100 billionaires, and got offers that TSI/SJM rejected
- SJM has already got £17m back

He ends with hope that the current distressed sale isn't scuppers by the lender wanting more as he thinks the buyers will be a good fit. I guess our opinion of that will show how genuine he is if and when it happens, but to me he seemed like the sort of person the club needed to employ in order to secure a buyer and not as RL paints him.

Re Kebe & Mariappa I'm not really that surprised. We exchanged those two for Drenthe, Williams and Bridge - two of who may not have needed a transfer fee, but almost certainly would have had signing on fees.

Anton was expecting a mate to sign on and then to be able to rustle up other investors. Daddy was security from what I understand from reading all the recent interview stuff.

£46m last season in wages, and £10m - £12m blackhole suggests to me wages this season of somewhere in the region of £33m.

Without a huge chance of shifting probably our two biggest earners (Pog & Drenthe), we're gonna need to get rid of most of Guthrie, McCleary, Williams, Obita, McCarthy & Federici, if not more, to get even close to the level we need to reduce that. And I just can't see them all being desired enough.

Yep, and it's amazing that there are a few mongs who want a billionaire appointed ASAP so we can start splashing the cash. Are people really that dense? New owner or not the transfer strategy needs to remain as offloading players until the wage bill is more reasonable for this division.

[multisync1830]

I thought the CS interview was pretty good, I don't really see him as the bad guy here.

Some interesting things he said:
- Confirmed a distressed sale is in progress
- Kebe and Mariappa sales (and presumably prem wages) didn't cover last seasons signings
- SJM/TSI wanted £25m for the club which was (in hindsight) too high
- AZ ran away because he couldn't get the money he was expecting to get - presumably from his dad!
- the wage bill needs a £10m to £12m topup each season
- the vibrac loan is £10.5m and due in Aug
- the debt is £20m, which sounds too low for me so I assume TSI/SJM are writing off around 50% of what they are owned
- He has directly approached 100 billionaires, and got offers that TSI/SJM rejected
- SJM has already got £17m back

He ends with hope that the current distressed sale isn't scuppers by the lender wanting more as he thinks the buyers will be a good fit. I guess our opinion of that will show how genuine he is if and when it happens, but to me he seemed like the sort of person the club needed to employ in order to secure a buyer and not as RL paints him.

Re Kebe & Mariappa I'm not really that surprised. We exchanged those two for Drenthe, Williams and Bridge - two of who may not have needed a transfer fee, but almost certainly would have had signing on fees.

Anton was expecting a mate to sign on and then to be able to rustle up other investors. Daddy was security from what I understand from reading all the recent interview stuff.

£46m last season in wages, and £10m - £12m blackhole suggests to me wages this season of somewhere in the region of £33m.

Without a huge chance of shifting probably our two biggest earners (Pog & Drenthe), we're gonna need to get rid of most of Guthrie, McCleary, Williams, Obita, McCarthy & Federici, if not more, to get even close to the level we need to reduce that. And I just can't see them all being desired enough.

Yep, and it's amazing that there are a few mongs who want a billionaire appointed ASAP so we can start splashing the cash. Are people really that dense? New owner or not the transfer strategy needs to remain as offloading players until the wage bill is more reasonable for this division.

If Kim Jong-un was announced as the new owner there would be uproar, if he announced he was buying Lionel Messi the adoration here would embarrass even the most sycophantic North Koreans.

[madstadblues]

Hindsight.com

I have been following this thread with interest and would really like to know what the Mr Mad & TS1 Anton haters would have done in a similar position.

If you're a 70 year old bloke who owns a football club that needs constant funding to maintain the success enjoyed over the past 20 years, been hammered by the recession & and would really like to enjoy the twilight years I know what decision I would have made?

[3points]

And they do have step in rights if there's been a default on the loan - one default was unpaid tax bills. Those rights then allow them to take control of the assets, make disposals, etc (hence the sale of ALF no doubt)

I guess it all depends on whether or not they have step in rights for any default, or just their loan. If they are not due to be paid until August then RFC will not have defaulted.
HMRC default may be included (very common for football clubs to do this and for this to be one of the first signs of trouble, with the next being unpaid wages), but as this has been remedied it is unclear if this would give them the

The wording in the debenture document clearly stated default on taxes was a default under the facility agreement with Vibrac. Not sure on the timings, but HMRC has probably been remedied after Vibrac exercised its step in rights and forced the sale of ALF.

[TheLawnMowerMan]

The wording in the debenture document clearly stated default on taxes was a default under the facility agreement with Vibrac. Not sure on the timings, but HMRC has probably been remedied after Vibrac exercised its step in rights and forced the sale of ALF.

Thanks.
I guess the question from that is how they knew? I know that it has been talked about in the last few weeks, but I presume that this was after the step-in had happened.
HMRC don't go to the press about late payments. Would the club have a duty to tell Vibrac? Or did someone squeal?